[Echognome]

Scoring: IMP

1♣ - 1♠
1N - 2♦*
3♦ - 3♥
?

---

*Artificial, GF

You are just practicing some generic 2/1 with a non-regular partner. You haven't really discussed style, so you'll have to live with the 1N response. Sorry if you can't stand it, but it's the rebid I prefer.

[mikeh]

3N

Partner knows my values and approximate shape, and 3♠ (the alternative) would sound like 2=2=4=5.

Besides, xxx opposite xxx is often enough to prevent them cashing 5 hearts.

If partner was trying to stall, hoping to prompt 3N only with a stopper, too bad. Maybe the suit breaks 4-4

[ArtK78]

3NT.

I can't think of any reason why I would pick any other call. With the exception of 2♦, partner's calls are natural and forcing. He has spades and hearts, I have diamonds and clubs. Sounds like notrump to me.

[kenrexford]

The "problem" might be what precisely this sequence shows on Responder's side. I like for 1minor-1♠-1NT-3♥ to show 5-5, GF. This late 3♥, then, does not merit me fretting about my heart fragment.

Similarly, I like for 1minor-P-2♠ to show an intermediate hand, which allows 1minor-1♠-1NT-3♠ to be GF, and the 2♦ route to 3♠ different, such that I have no real serious concerns that 3♠ is "necessary."

Because of this, 3♥ seems to be a denial probe to me (and Mike), asking for help, whereas some folks (Art) might view 3♥ as showing a GF 5-5. This, of course, is quite important to have agreements concerning.

I think I'd pop in 3♠. Strange that neither Mike nor Art, clearly of different schools, conclude anything but 3NT, but I hit at 3♠. But, I don't think that 3♠ can be wrong here. If partner takes me for a doubleton, I'll ask which he prefers -- the King or the 3-2.

[Codo]

I agree with Mike (always a good idea).

I would hate to bid 3 NT, but there is simply no alternative after this start of the bidding.
And I would never believe that 3 Heart shows a 5 card suit here, but the good thing is: If pd is 55 in the majors, we have a stopper everywhere.

[jdonn]

kenrexford, on Jul 9 2008, 06:27 PM, said:

I think I'd pop in 3♠. Strange that neither Mike nor Art, clearly of different schools, conclude anything but 3NT, but I hit at 3♠. But, I don't think that 3♠ can be wrong here. If partner takes me for a doubleton, I'll ask which he prefers -- the King or the 3-2.

*sarcasm coming*

Perhaps, gasp....you shouldn't bid 3♠ with either of those holdings!

[gnasher]

jdonn, on Jul 10 2008, 08:26 AM, said:

kenrexford, on Jul 9 2008, 06:27 PM, said:

But, I don't think that 3♠ can be wrong here.  If partner takes me for a doubleton, I'll ask which he prefers -- the King or the 3-2.

*sarcasm coming*

Perhaps, gasp....you shouldn't bid 3♠ with either of those holdings!

If "denial probe" means "asking for a heart stop", I think 3♠ would be reasonable with either this hand or with xx xx AKJx KQ10xx. That doesn't compel responder to play in spades - he can follow the sequence ... 3♦-3♥-3♠-3NT to express doubt. If opener had ♠Hx and ♥xx, he would, of course, remove 3NT.

It seems rather unilateral to bid 3NT with ♥xxx when you have specifically been asked whether you have a heart stop.

[gnasher]

ArtK78, on Jul 9 2008, 08:50 PM, said:

3NT.

I can't think of any reason why I would pick any other call.  With the exception of 2♦, partner's calls are natural and forcing.  He has spades and hearts, I have diamonds and clubs.  Sounds like notrump to me.

Looking at it from responder's point of view, you have clubs and diamonds, and he has spades and hearts. Why didn't it sound like notrump to him?

[kenrexford]

gnasher, on Jul 10 2008, 03:34 AM, said:

If "denial probe" means "asking for a heart stop"

Yes, but more. I used the term "denial probe" as a more expansive concept, because Responder is unlimited. I don't like forcing an agenda on him. 3♥ may have been bid for 3NT purposes ("asking for a heart stop"). Or, perhaps 3♥ was bid preparatory to an intent to continue further with some sort of slam ambitions. If the latter, 3♥ (for me) will later turn out to have been a denial cue, consistent with the general feel of 3♥ as asking for something rather than showing something. In other words, it would seem somewhat inconsistent for 3♥ to be assumed to be asking for a stopper for game purposes but later changed to showing a control for slam purposes. So, I call this a "denial probe."