[Antrax]

Matchpoints, unfavourable.

---

You choose to open a 15-17 NT (right?), and LHO chimes in with a natural 2♥ overcall. Partner bids 2♠, which is a signoff bid with five spades or more. RHO passes. What do you bid?
If you choose to pass, LHO bids 3♦ and RHO corrects to 3♥. What now?

[the hog]

I don't pass. I bid 2NT which shows a real H stopper and excellent S support and asks partner to judge based on that. Passing with 5s is absurd.

[CSGibson]

I don't pass. I bid 3♠, which to me is a similar hand to which I would have super-accepted 3♠ over a normal transfer.

[SteveMoe]

CSGibson, on 2013-February-16, 03:25, said:

I don't pass. I bid 3♠, which to me is a similar hand to which I would have super-accepted 3♠ over a normal transfer.

What Chris said...

[kenberg]

This is a very strong hand to be opening 1NT. I believe I would open 1♠. However, let's suppose I open 1NT, and it goes (2♥)-2♠-(Pass)-?
Surely I raise spades. We have a ten card fit. We will not be allowed to play this in 2♠. Despite the unfavorable vulnerability and the bad heart position, I would expect 3♠ to be a safe contract. Among other things, if they then go on to four of something partner will know that we have at least a nine card fit and will be able to figure we are not taking many spades on defense. He will do what is right. Or so we hope. But we will have provided him with the important features of our hand that will help him judge.

[chasetb]

I open 1♠ as well, this hand is worth a lot more than 17. And I will go to 3♠ as well for the reasons the other posters listed above.

[aguahombre]

Yes, this is an 18 and should have been opened 1♠.

Yes, once we did open 1NT, we must raise to 3♠.

However, if we were sitting in for someone who had passed or had used an unfortunate 2NT gadget allowing Lefty and Righty more opportunities, we have an entirely different concern.
We might as well bid 4♠, over their 3H, or PASS ---not 3♠; they are headed for a makeable 4H contract, and a pass might derail it.

BTW: thanks, Antrax, for the subtitle; we can avoid wasting our limited brainpower on some other possible agenda.

This post has been edited by aguahombre: 2013-February-16, 09:36

[nige1]

Antrax writes "Matchpoints, unfavourable. You choose to open a 15-17 NT (right?), and LHO chimes in with a natural 2♥ overcall. Partner bids 2♠, which is a signoff bid with five spades or more. RHO passes. What do you bid?
If you choose to pass, LHO bids 3♦ and RHO corrects to 3♥. What now?"
IMO ...
As opener, prefer 1♠ (10) to 1N (7), especially if playing Gazilli
After 2♠, prefer 3♠ (10) or 4♠ (9) to Pass (8)
After RHO's 3♥, prefer Pass (10) to 3♠ (8).
Raising (at any stage) is not necessarily the right tactic as it may jockey opponents into a making game.

---

[ggwhiz]

With my colour blind (and glass 1/2 full) pard I'm sacking in 3♠ and should bid it directly hoping it's only down 1 and they can't bid and make game.

[steve2005]

yes, would open 1♠
would have directly raised(superaccept) to 3♠ hoping partner can bid 4♠

[the hog]

aguahombre, on 2013-February-16, 09:27, said:

Yes, this is an 18 and should have been opened 1♠.

Yes, once we did open 1NT, we must raise to 3♠.

However, if we were sitting in for someone who had passed or had used an unfortunate 2NT gadget allowing Lefty and Righty more opportunities, we have an entirely different concern.
We might as well bid 4♠, over their 3H, or PASS ---not 3♠; they are headed for a makeable 4H contract, and a pass might derail it.

BTW: thanks, Antrax, for the subtitle; we can avoid wasting our limited brainpower on some other possible agenda.

Unfortunate 2NT gadget?
I am curious as to how you would get pd to bid 3NT with. Perhaps you would like to try 4S?
Kxxxxx
xx
Kxx
xx

[aguahombre]

the hog, on 2013-February-17, 20:08, said:

Unfortunate 2NT gadget?
I am curious as to how you would get pd to bid 3NT with. Perhaps you would like to try 4S?
Kxxxxx
xx
Kxx
xx

I don't refer to other people's toys as good, bad etc. I just know why we don't use them. In the OP case it allows the opponents room when we already know the auction is competitive. There certainly are specific hands where your methods work better than this one, and so "unfortunate" is the correct term.

Without competition the 2nt call would have much merit as 2M+1 in a transfer sequence. Our partnership chooses to adapt to the circumstances. But it is all moot here, because of the questionable choice to not open 1S with an 18.

[Antrax]

Yeah, I'll open another thread about my choice of opening bid.
I like the explanation of several posters here that 3♠ is like a super-accept to a transfer. I'll discuss it with partner - we never thought about continuations after a "signoff" bid.

Not sure if the complete hand is interesting - at the table I only bid 3♠ over 3♥, LHO bumped to 4♥, partner doubled on ♥QTxx and a side Q and they went for 800 on a spade lead - dummy was 2=2=3=6.

[nige1]

Antrax, on 2013-February-17, 21:41, said:

Not sure if the complete hand is interesting - at the table I only bid 3♠ over 3♥, LHO bumped to 4♥, partner doubled on ♥QTxx and a side Q and they went for 800 on a spade lead - dummy was 2=2=3=6.

Yes please, Antrax. The full hand would be interesting

[Antrax]

---

The EW pair, BTW, scored 59.71% in that round and placed second overall with 61.09% after three rounds, so I guess their bidding is tailored to the level of the opposition.

[ArtK78]

Antrax, on 2013-February-18, 07:42, said:

---

The EW pair, BTW, scored 59.71% in that round and placed second overall with 61.09% after three rounds, so I guess their bidding is tailored to the level of the opposition.

Your opps may have scored well in the round and in the event, but East's heart preference and West's game bid are two of the oddest actions I have seen in some time.

[Antrax]

Which is why I wrote that disclaimer I was actually pretty shocked they placed so high, this wasn't the only board we played against them where we came out significantly ahead, and their overall style seemed too wild to be a consistent winner.

[kenberg]

I agree with Art, and probably with everyone else, that the EW bidding is incomprehensible. Did you happen to notice if there were any 620s your way? Not likely to be bid but the fact that there are ten tricks in spades would appear to be a pretty good argument for an immediate raise of 2♠ to 3♠.

To go further into the fantasy world, it's possible that after West's extravagant bidding that North would decide West must be void in spades and run the ten. Oops. Nah.

Anyway, I don't care how the EW pair placed, their bidding is nuts. I believe in allowing for different approaches but this is from outer space.

[Antrax]

(I rotated the hand, we were EW)
100
100
100
100
100
-150
-150
-170
-170
-170
-170
-170
-170
-200
-200
-200
-500
-620
-620
-620
-620
-650
-800

[kenberg]

Not flat! thanks.