[Shugart23]

Playing Matchpoints, both Red......you hold Kx Spades, Jx Hearts, Axxxx Diamonds, and 10,xxx Clubs.. You Pass, LHO bids 1D, partner doubles, RHO bids 1S....what is your bid ?

[ahydra]

I'll try 1NT

ahydra

[kuhchung]

Say, with complete sincerity:

Sorry, <pet name for significant other>. My fault.

[mike777]

edit
I will try pass.
I have some defense.
give pard a typical hand of:

Axxx,.,Axxx..x...Axxx


p=1d=x=1s
?

[nige1]

Shugart23, on 2015-March-29, 13:30, said:

Playing Matchpoints, both Red......
you hold ♠ K x ♥ J x ♦ A x x x x ♣ 10 x x x ..
_P (1♦) _X (1♠)
??

IMO Pass = Sleep on Sofa. 1N = Trial separation. 2♣ = Divorce. Double = Sleep with the fishes.

[ArtK78]

Pass.

Nige's analysis gives one a choice between lesser of evils. Pass is my choice, but I don't think the predicted result is right.

[mikeh]

Pass

I think bidding is too aggressive red.

1♠ is forcing on the opps and my hand suggests that they are likely to be rebidding 1N, and that that will end the auction. If they rebid anything but notrump, then I think either partner didn't have his double, or they've made a mistake...the only exception being if they rebid diamonds, and now I am going to be really happy I didn't bid 1N, assuming that my diamonds really are Axxxx, with no semblance of a second stopper.

While declarer sometimes enjoys a 'declarer's advantage', this hand doesn't stack up that way. My heart J is likely a good card to hold, since the odds are that partner will lead that suit against my predicted 1N contract.

If they make 6 tricks, then we would be +90 in 1N, but +100 on defence. If they make 7 tricks, then we would be -100 in 1N and -90 on defence.

If we were white, I'd bid 1N in a heartbeat, since the arithmetic is exactly opposite in that we are better off declaring regardless of who makes 6 or 7 tricks.

I once read that at mps, when both sides have roughly half the deck and no unusual features, the side that gets to 1N first usually wins. Even at red, that is often the case because of the declarer advantage, but here I just don't see either side having much of an edge based on the auction.

Am I positive that pass will work best? No. Am I pretty confident it is the percentage auction? Yes.

[ggwhiz]

kuhchung, on 2015-March-30, 13:56, said:

Say, with complete sincerity:

Sorry, <pet name for significant other>. My fault.

Exactly my approach. When my (now) wife first moved here she played with randoms that crapped on her from a dizzy height even when THEY blew it. She was in hyper defensive mode when we started.

After a month of the above I got a stream of "well maybe I couldda" with a bunch of "no you did fine" and life is good. We did agree to play frequent 4-card overcalls and real deal doubles as a result her mood really improved, making her a happy pitcher and with me catching a few knuckleballs.

I get to bid 1nt with no blowback if it doesn't work.

[ggwhiz]

double post

[WesleyC]

Pass and 1NT are both reasonable choices.

My default action would be to pass, however I would lean towards 1NT against a pair that might slop a trick in the defense.

[mike777]

again I thought the rules of the game were the opp are wc players they do not make mistakes.


If you change the rules to the opp are sloppy ok.

[mike777]

dup

[Shugart23]

Ok, thanks.....I did choose to Pass because the colors were Red, and I wanted to see where things might end up......Of course, since my wife wanted me to bid, I think I will take the sage advice and continue to apologize for my mistake.

Btw, was the opponent's 1S forcing ? It shows less than 9 or 10 points...I would play it as not-forcing and might pass with a weak opening hand and 3 Spades

[mike777]

this is not true, you do not redouble with all 10+ hands.

[mikeh]

Shugart23, on 2015-March-31, 06:29, said:

Ok, thanks.....I did choose to Pass because the colors were Red, and I wanted to see where things might end up......Of course, since my wife wanted me to bid, I think I will take the sage advice and continue to apologize for my mistake.

Btw, was the opponent's 1S forcing ? It shows less than 9 or 10 points...I would play it as not-forcing and might pass with a weak opening hand and 3 Spades

that was the standard treatment many, many years ago, but for the past several decades the standard approach is to play a 1-level suit response as forcing at least one round....one ignores the double unless one has at least 10 hcp AND an interest in penalizing them.

[ggwhiz]

Shugart23, on 2015-March-31, 06:29, said:

Btw, was the opponent's 1S forcing ? It shows less than 9 or 10 points...I would play it as not-forcing and might pass with a weak opening hand and 3 Spades

The majority play it as forcing by an unpassed hand but it's a mistake to cater to the opponents methods in any event. Your style needs to be discussed and determined....... by your wife but you can offer choices. When you nod sagely when she chooses whatever you're in a good place.

[Shugart23]

Well ,we play precision, so our opening bid is capped at 15 HCP generally, so I am not sure there is an advantage to us to switch to partner's bid being forcing after opponent's double...eg. 1S by me - Double - 2H by my beloved....seems like it is easier for us to determine how high to sacrifice.......But maybe I need to think on this...Do other Precision players play it same or different than me ?

[helene_t]

Yeah, I don't think it makes any difference whether you play limited or wide-ranging openings.

Notrump range could matter, though. The opener hands that might want to pass a nonforcing response are mostly weak balanced hands so if you play weak notrump it makes less sense to play nonforcing responses.

Anyway, as mikeh says, it is fairly old fashioned to play it as nonforcing. If you have to redouble with all strong hands, the next hand will often make weak jumps after your redouble and you will be in an akward situation.

But if you really want to be able to stop at the 1-level you could play transfers, i.e. after 1♦:
rdbl->hearts
1♥->spades
1♠->notrumps
1NT->clubs
2♣->positive diamond raise
2♦->weak diamond raise

(or something like that. Some switch 1NT and 1♠ and there are more variations).

[mikeh]

Shugart23, on 2015-April-01, 08:05, said:

Well ,we play precision, so our opening bid is capped at 15 HCP generally, so I am not sure there is an advantage to us to switch to partner's bid being forcing after opponent's double...eg. 1S by me - Double - 2H by my beloved....seems like it is easier for us to determine how high to sacrifice.......But maybe I need to think on this...Do other Precision players play it same or different than me ?

There has always been a big difference between a 1 level response over a takeout double and a 2/1 response, at least since it became common to play the former as forcing.

Thus in standard, and this was certainly also true in the various forms of forcing club I have played, including several versions of precision, the auction 1♦[x] 1M was forcing, but 1♥ [x] 2♣ was not.

Many tournament players use transfers now, as advances over a takeout double, and they have powerful advantages (which is why they have become popular, of course).

The point about the response at the one-level being forcing has nothing at all to do with the range of strength shown by opener. It is all about being able to avoid being pre-empted out of one's fit by having to redouble and then seeing 4th seat jump pre-emptively.....when the auction comes around to responder, he has not even begun to show his shape, and this makes all auctions inefficient.

Moreover, the purpose of the power redouble is to allow the partnership to defend a low-level doubled contract.....which we don't want to do very often when responder has a distributional hand....when responder has a shapely hand, the odds are high that the opps have a fit that will play fairly well at the 1 or 2 level. We rate to punish them mostly when responder has a balanced hand or a semi-balanced hand short in opener's suit. That is why so few experienced players (none, that I know of) play that the redouble is mandatory on all 10+ hands.