[luke warm]

♠AJT84
♥T85
♦94
♣Q54

[Free]

Pass, you have everything you never wanted to open 2♠.

[Blofeld]

3rd seat favourable I don't think that I want to be predictable.

So, I'll vary what I bid. Sometimes I'll pass. Sometimes bid 1♠ (which looks probably more helpful than 2♠), sometimes 2. 1NT is less appealing playing a strong no-trump than a weak one, where the bid is partially protected, but ...

[Double !]

2 shovels♠ (spades) in a heartbeat.

1) i have interior sequence with Ace/ I want or can stand the lead.
2) pressure bidding on lho
3) without good fit and distro, pard better have a good reason for taking further action
4) am of the old KS school that advocates keeping 3rd seat openers relatively up to strength in order to not distort the rest of the system and create the needs for compensatory conventions to guard against a light opener. If you bid 1S and P makes a negX, I'll help you purchase the shovel to did the hole you will want to crawl into.
5) if you pass, chances are good that you might never get a chance to show spade holding.

6) by not bidding now, partner might infer that you have length but not much strength in spades at some point during the play of the hand and defend accordingly on a negative inference.

[mike777]

Blofeld, on Jun 12 2005, 12:22 PM, said:

3rd seat favourable I don't think that I want to be predictable.

PASS

3RD seat favourable I think that I want to be predictable.
Pass with 5323 shape and less than 11hcp.
Of course my pass may fool opp more than my bidding 1 or 2 spades.

[Double !]

3rd seat favorable, anything goes.

CAVEAT EMPTOR (or caveat pre-emptor)
especially if matchpoints.

guess itz a matter of style.
pard should feel lucky that i have at least 5 spades, I have known a few people who would open 2S on 4-bagger favorable- 3rd seat.
(also 3 of a suit on xxxxx nv/ lolololol)

and, I would rather make this type of bid that to open a weak 2 bid on a J or Q-empty 6th suit with outside cards such as seems to be in vogue these days.
Told ye, I am a dinosaur when it comes to certain bidding principles.

[luke warm]

Scoring: IMP

---

E----------S----------W----------N

P----------P---------2♠--------3D
4♠-----P-----------X .... all pass

the result was e/w -500... imo it seems that pass allows n/s to find the (cold) 4♥ or 5♦ games, with whatever tools are available, tho i guess they wouldn't always do so

[Free]

woohoo, a 3 imp win because NS don't play any weak 55+ openings...

[luke warm]

yes fredrick, we all know how unimportant those 3 imp swings are

[mike777]

luke warm, on Jun 12 2005, 04:05 PM, said:

Dealer: East Vul: N/S Scoring: IMP

♠ KQ2 ♥ Q74 ♦ AKQT32 ♣ 2 ♠ AJT84 ♥ T85 ♦ 94 ♣ Q54 ♠ 9753 ♥ J3 ♦ J85 ♣ AKJ9 ♠ 6 ♥ AK962 ♦ 76 ♣ T8763

E----------S----------W----------N

P----------P---------2♠--------3D
4♠-----P-----------X .... all pass

the result was e/w -500... imo it seems that pass allows n/s to find the (cold) 4♥ or 5♦ games, with whatever tools are available, tho i guess they wouldn't always do so

I can pass in third seat with my hand since P cannot have that hand.
4234 with 10HCP NV in first seat open ONE CLUB. We find our double fit in clubs and spades fast.

Much harder for opp to find 4H or 5D now.

[luke warm]

ok, i understand that.. but i don't understand why it matters... he could still raise you to 4♠ with 6 hcp and a 5232 hand, right? as a matter of fact, it seems safer to do it on a 6 count than a 10 count

[hrothgar]

mike777, on Jun 13 2005, 12:25 AM, said:

4234 with 10HCP NV in first seat open ONE CLUB. We find our double fit in clubs and spades fast.

Much harder for opp to find 4H or 5D now.

I like to open light, I REALLY do
Even with an agreement to open 10-12 HCP hands, I'm passing this one.
It looks like a 9 count to me

Jx and Jxx really aren't pulling their weight

[mike777]

luke warm, on Jun 12 2005, 04:32 PM, said:

ok, i understand that.. but i don't understand why it matters... he could still raise you to 4♠ with 6 hcp and a 5232 hand, right?

Well seems easy to get to 4s with your example 5-5 fit hands NV?
P=P=P=1D
1s?

Now opener may overcall 1s as passed hand or....
p=p=p=1d
p=1h=1s?

Note on this 5-4 fit hand it is the double fit in clubs and spades that makes the hand only minus 500 and the opp making, yes?
If you open 2s and p has some other 4 card raise to 4s..it may or may not be disaster, yes?

[hrothgar]

luke warm, on Jun 12 2005, 07:52 PM, said:

♠AJT84
♥T85
♦94
♣Q54

I'm also passing...
Bad shape (5332s are evil)
Decent defense

If I were forced to open, I prefer 1S or even 1♣ to 2♠

[MickyB]

I'm kinda surprised by the responses so far, I'm opening 2♠ in a flash (or in tempo). Perfect conditions for a lead-directing pressure bid.

[pbleighton]

Three little words:

Third seat favorable.

2S easy, in spite of 5332.

Peter

[luke warm]

mike777, on Jun 12 2005, 04:05 PM, said:

Note on this 5-4 fit hand it is the double fit in clubs and spades that makes the hand only minus 500 and the opp making, yes?
If you open 2s and p has some other 4 card raise to 4s..it may or may not be disaster, yes?

true

i wonder how it would have gone had west passed... it's possible n/s might not even reach game... to me, that's the biggest advantage to passing

[Double !]

luke warm, on Jun 12 2005, 07:20 PM, said:

mike777, on Jun 12 2005, 04:05 PM, said:

Note on this 5-4 fit hand it is the double fit in clubs and spades that makes the hand only minus 500 and the opp making, yes?
If you open 2s and p has some other 4 card raise to 4s..it may or may not be disaster, yes?

true

note that partner, albeit under some pressure, broke discipline by bidding 4S. The shape isn't that great. Sorry, but if one's agreements are all bets are off 3rd seat, favorable, then partner can't assume you have a 6-bagger, and decent shape is needed along with twump support. Are the opps getting to 4H if responder/advancer bids only 3S? doubt it.

[Winstonm]

1S: This is likely my first and last chance to aid the defense and I have a strong preference for a spade lead.

WinstonM

[civill]

2♠ must be a double-dummy open bid.
1♠ open is in the WOS.
Pass is generally.

?