[ManUtdNZ]

West is the Dealer & NV. What should they open (if at all)?

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Options my partner had:
a)Pass
b)Bid 2♠ showing M and a minor and at most 10 hcp
c)Preempt with 3♣

What do people suggest and why?

Any help most appreciated.

Kind regards

[mw64ahw]

I play something like this https://www.chrisrya...wo/frelling.htm
So 2♠
I'll use the same bid over a 1♦ or 1♥ opening. Happy to rebid 4♣ over interference to show 5xx6

[mikeh]

Anyone who claims to know what’s best on weak freak hands is either a lucky guesser or just wrong.

White v red I’d enjoy opening 3C then bidding spades at any level up to 4S. But that’s just a guess and in no way am I suggesting that up it’s a smart bid.

Today, I opened 3C with A void 109xxx KJ98xxx….partner raised to 4C with xxxxx xxx xx AQx and I bid 5C over RHO’s double. They needed to lead a club, but didn’t so I was able to ruff two diamonds and take 11 tricks, but that’s a far better playing hand than the OP hand.

My own guess? I think pass is most likely to lead to a good result.

[fuzzyquack]

I remember one of great Italians preempting with a similar hand in a minor and then bidding again showing his major.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

2S as 2-suiter is an option, as long as it showes at least 5/5,
if you play it as 5/4, dont do it, dont even think about it.
If 2S is at least 5/5, 2S is ok, you show the 5th spade and selling
the hand as 6/5 is not the worst crime.

I would also advice against 3C.

If you cant bid 2S, and cant bring yourself to pass, go with 4C,
and be done with the hand.

With kind regards
Marlowe

PS: I quite often pass those hands, and it works remarkedly well, less
spectatcular, but quite consistent.

[ManUtdNZ]

Many thanks for your thoughts. At the table my partner passed and opponents found 4H which made. I'm of the opinion that 4C would have stiffled the bidding which would have aided us on the score sheet.

Appreciate your comments.

Brian

[mikeh]

ManUtdNZ, on 2024-February-16, 19:37, said:

Many thanks for your thoughts. At the table my partner passed and opponents found 4H which made. I'm of the opinion that 4C would have stiffled the bidding which would have aided us on the score sheet.

Appreciate your comments.

Brian

Without knowing both your hand and the bidding as it happened, one can’t properly assess the result.

I’ll accept, provisionally, that a 4C opening would have ‘worked’ but that doesn’t make it the correct bid as opposed to the ‘out there’ action that happened to work on this particular day. It’s very, very easy to see ‘resulting’ on hands like these.

I’m not saying that’s what you’ve indulged in…just that it’s simply impossible to know with the limited information you’ve provided. You most certainly have zero reason to criticize your partner for passing. Let alone for not making a completely off the wall bid such as 4C.

[helene_t]

2S it is.

[paulg]

My experience, not that anyone has a lot with such hands, is that partner has a far better idea of my hand when I open clubs and then bid spades, as opposed to when I show spades and try to show clubs.

[Cyberyeti]

paulg, on 2024-February-17, 04:19, said:

My experience, not that anyone has a lot with such hands, is that partner has a far better idea of my hand when I open clubs and then bid spades, as opposed to when I show spades and try to show clubs.

Playing what I used to play before the EBU outlawed it, partner would be aware my clubs might be longer.

I would ask how the auction went, as I'm likely to come in later if I pass

[mycroft]

Again, whole hand, whole auction,...

But I would be less surprised than you that a preempt - whatever the preempt - didn't keep them out of game. 3♣-3♥-pass-4♥ or 4♣-X-pass-4♥ are very common auctions. I'd be less surprised if you opened with spades in this auction (or were able to top-and-bottom cuebid) that they would end up having to make a decision over 4♠ (which does, effectively but maybe not optimally, keep them out of 4♥).

I would also be concerned that 4♥+2 is a pretty good score, and preempting (in particular, showing both suits and willingness to play even without points) might help them find a making slam on this goulash. (Of course, if it is on, it is likely that at least one of 6♠ or 7♣ pays. But pretty certain it won't beat -480).

Does that mean I wouldn't open? Well, with most of my partners, playing most of my systems, I wouldn't - because partner won't expect this. And I give up some "push the opponents around" to avoid confusing partner even more than they usually are (I certainly don't want to hear 3♣-pass-3NT; probably don't want to hear 2♠-pass-4♠, or 2♠-3♥-p-4♥; p-p-X, especially when 3 spade tricks cash - for them). If your agreements include these kinds of hands and suits, then go for it. But mine don't - and we have our reasons. Even if they're suboptimal, it's not the worst leaker-of-points in our game.