[rduran1216]

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Opening lead

♣A,3,5,4
♠x,?,10,?


Your move.

[cherdano]

Since this is posted in A/E, I would assume the opponents have carding agreements?

[nige1]

rduran1216 asked
Opening lead
♣A,3,5,4
♠x,?,10,?
Your move.

Prospects are bleak. To limit likely damage, win ♠J and lead a ♣, intending to play ♣Q if LHO ducks. With luck, this may allow you to ruff a club or two and reduce the number of ♠ ruffs by LHO

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[phil_20686]

nige1, on 2011-June-29, 02:52, said:

rduran1216 asked
Opening lead
♣A,3,5,4
♠x,?,10,?
Your move.

Prospects are bleak. To limit likely damage, win ♠J and lead a ♣, intending to play ♣Q if LHO ducks. With luck, this may allow you to ruff a club or two and reduce the number of ♠ ruffs by LHO

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This does not look right. You seem to have the hands the wrong way up= south is on lead. To avoid a spade ruff or trumps being drawn you must play north for something like xx AJx ???? Jxxx, in this case you can make if you time your play carefully. Start with a club to the ten, this will fetch a club return, now ruff a club with the K and play a heart to the ten. cross in spades and play a heart to the Q. You will score 1 clubb 1 club ruff 4 heart tricks 3 spades and one diamond.

ok you might not need to actually ruff with the K, but if you should play the k earlier south will be able to ruff in front of dummy with 9x or Jx or something.

[nige1]

phil_20686, on 2011-June-29, 04:57, said:

This does not look right. You seem to have the hands the wrong way up= south is on lead. To avoid a spade ruff or trumps being drawn you must play north for something like xx AJx ???? Jxxx, in this case you can make if you time your play carefully. Start with a club to the ten, this will fetch a club return, now ruff a club with the K and play a heart to the ten. cross in spades and play a heart to the Q. You will score 1 club 1 club ruff 4 heart tricks 3 spades and one diamond.

ok you might not need to actually ruff with the K, but if you should play the k earlier south will be able to ruff in front of dummy with 9x or Jx or something.

As phil_20686 surmised, I thought West was declarer. A club to the ten is a better shot. IMO, declarer's best hope is to cross-ruff, after cashing two spades and discarding a spade on ♣Q. You hope RHO is 2-4-3-4 or 2-3-4-4

[phil_20686]

nige1, on 2011-June-29, 10:11, said:

A club to the ten is a better shot. IMO, declarer's best hope is to cross-ruff, after cashing two spades and discarding a spade on ♣Q. You hope RHO is 2-4-3-4 or 2-3-4-4

It seems like this is close to no play with dummies heart pips so poor. If rho is 2-3-4-4 say, lho can ruff the fourth club in front of dummy to force out the K, and now it is impossible to ruff the 3rd spade without being overruffed. If dummy had the heart 9 aswell then the cross ruff may well be correct.

You are not having a good day today Nige

[nige1]

phil_20686, on 2011-June-29, 10:54, said:

You are not having a good day today Nige

[kayin801]

Agree that carding info would be nice.

How about playing for a layout like this:

---

If N has 5♥s we're screwed I think, so for his penalty X I think he probably has the ♦K, unless South's overcalls are really really sound.

I tried to make the crossruff work (especially in the 5-0 trumps case), but they always come to 2 clubs, and then the ♥A and another ♥ in the endgame. Unless of course S is the type to overcall on 9xxx of spades

If we give N the hand above then:

2: win ♠ in dummy
3: ♣ to 10 and A
4: ♠ won in dummy
5: ♥ towards hand covering N's card*
6/7: ♦A and ♦ ruff
8/9: ♣Q pitching a spade and ♣ ruff
10: ♦ ruff
11: ♠ ruff with K

And we pick up the last two tricks if N overruffs by covering N's heart or we lead a ♦ toward hand if he underruffs to score a ♥.

If N goes up with the ♥A at trick 5, then we win a non-trump return and crossruff, pitching a spade along the way on the ♣ winner so we can trump coup in the end (I think this works? I've already spent too much time on this post)

If N goes up with the ♥ A and send back a low ♥ (strongest?), then we win in dummy, pick up trumps, and pseudo-squeeze N in the minors? (I GUESS he could have KJ10, now I've gotten bored )

There is probably some other really complicated variation if S has AKJ of clubs, but I think it involves ruffing out his winner to pitch a spade.

*Waits for someone to point out what is wrong*

[phil_20686]

kayin801, on 2011-June-29, 14:56, said:

Agree that carding info would be nice.

How about playing for a layout like this:

---

If N has 5♥s we're screwed I think, so for his penalty X I think he probably has the ♦K, unless South's overcalls are really really sound.

I tried to make the crossruff work (especially in the 5-0 trumps case), but they always come to 2 clubs, and then the ♥A and another ♥ in the endgame. Unless of course S is the type to overcall on 9xxx of spades

If we give N the hand above then:

2: win ♠ in dummy
3: ♣ to 10 and A
4: ♠ won in dummy
5: ♥ towards hand covering N's card*
6/7: ♦A and ♦ ruff
8/9: ♣Q pitching a spade and ♣ ruff
10: ♦ ruff
11: ♠ ruff with Q

And we pick up the last two tricks if N overruffs by covering N's heart or we lead a ♦ toward hand if he underruffs to score a ♥.

If N goes up with the ♥A at trick 5, then we win a non-trump return and crossruff, pitching a spade along the way on the ♣ winner so we can trump coup in the end (I think this works? I've already spent too much time on this post)

If N goes up with the ♥ A and send back a low ♥ (strongest?), then we win in dummy, pick up trumps, and pseudo-squeeze N in the minors? (I GUESS he could have KJ10, now I've gotten bored )

There is probably some other really complicated variation if S has AKJ of clubs, but I think it involves ruffing out his winner to pitch a spade.

*Waits for someone to point out what is wrong*

I agree, this is basically the line i suggested. You can choose between 4-1 or 3-2 trumps. If trumps are 3-2 you are in a bind on this line as instead of a spade return south can play a third club and now he can ruff the 4th club in front of dummy with say 9x and force you to overruff with the K and it all turns a bit ugly. So basically we have a line vs 3-2 trumps with AJx in the slot, or a line vs 4-1 trumps with AJxx in the slot. Either can work but you have to choose.

Perhaps the biding does suggest 4-1 trumps but it is by no means a lock.

[rhm]

kayin801, on 2011-June-29, 14:56, said:

Agree that carding info would be nice.

How about playing for a layout like this:

---

If N has 5♥s we're screwed I think, so for his penalty X I think he probably has the ♦K, unless South's overcalls are really really sound.

I tried to make the crossruff work (especially in the 5-0 trumps case), but they always come to 2 clubs, and then the ♥A and another ♥ in the endgame. Unless of course S is the type to overcall on 9xxx of spades

If we give N the hand above then:

2: win ♠ in dummy
3: ♣ to 10 and A
4: ♠ won in dummy
5: ♥ towards hand covering N's card*
6/7: ♦A and ♦ ruff
8/9: ♣Q pitching a spade and ♣ ruff
10: ♦ ruff
11: ♠ ruff with Q

And we pick up the last two tricks if N overruffs by covering N's heart or we lead a ♦ toward hand if he underruffs to score a ♥.

If N goes up with the ♥A at trick 5, then we win a non-trump return and crossruff, pitching a spade along the way on the ♣ winner so we can trump coup in the end (I think this works? I've already spent too much time on this post)

If N goes up with the ♥ A and send back a low ♥ (strongest?), then we win in dummy, pick up trumps, and pseudo-squeeze N in the minors? (I GUESS he could have KJ10, now I've gotten bored )

There is probably some other really complicated variation if S has AKJ of clubs, but I think it involves ruffing out his winner to pitch a spade.

*Waits for someone to point out what is wrong*

Assuming South has one more entry ( the ♣K), ♠ must be 5-2 and you have to play back a ♣ next so that South has no entry to give North a ♠ ruff.
If you assume that South singleton trump is the ♥J you can make the contract legitimately provided you can establish a ♣ trick for yourself, either North having a ♣ honor or South having ♣AKJ tight.
I doubt that North will be capable of ducking with ♣Kxxx when you play a second ♣ to the ♣ten
So start with trick 2&3 as above.
The plan is to ruff your ♣ loser before cashing the ♣Q (to avoid an over-ruff), play the ♥K to pin the ♥J and finesse against the ♥9 next.
If South attacks dummy's ♦ entry instead of playing back a second ♠, which you would win in hand to ruff your ♣ loser, you need to play next the ♥K and if ducked come to hand in ♠ to ruff your ♣ loser before taking the finesse against the ♥9.

Rainer Herrmann

[rduran1216]

This was the layout

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I got it wrong at the table, just curious if anyone would get it right.

[phil_20686]

This is what we like to call a grosveneror. Impossible to envisage that south has let this through on the lead in such a grotesque fashion, following such a grotesque overcall.