[Scarabin]

mike777, on 2013-October-22, 03:02, said:

Yes Blacklist has 2 tricks, the villain and pretty good ones of the week and just who the heck is fbi agent liz and her hubby and what are they up to? Spader makes the show. I will keep watching but the comments above are on target.


Long wait for Homeland season 2 on Netflix...I wait. btw it is filmed around where I live. I watched Newsroom....I guess this season was a bit better than last. Again I recommend Spiral, French Paris cop show for anyone on Netflix. It shows the very gritty side of Paris and French justice system. Very different from USA/UK/CAnada

When I miss an episode of Homeland I can see it on tenplay.com.au. It's the website of one of our local(ie not cable) TV channels. It may not work for you - when I've accessed similar sites in US I've been told the facilities only apply to locals - but it may be worth a try.

[barmar]

billw55, on 2013-October-24, 21:18, said:

My nickel says they planned it that way from the start.

Most certainly. Lisa Edelstein was only signed for 3 episodes.

[mike777]

Scarabin, on 2013-October-24, 22:37, said:

When I miss an episode of Homeland I can see it on tenplay.com.au. It's the website of one of our local(ie not cable) TV channels. It may not work for you - when I've accessed similar sites in US I've been told the facilities only apply to locals - but it may be worth a try.

After long wait I get to start to watch homeland season 2 next week...I cant wait....though I hear rumors that many are not happy.


agree with above castle comments.
I enjoy watching old Poriot shows..I understand one more season has been made...but I only hope with captain hastings, ms lemon and inspector japp.

[Scarabin]

mike777, on 2013-October-25, 00:06, said:

After long wait I get to start to watch homeland season 2 next week...I cant wait....though I hear rumors that many are not happy.


agree with above castle comments.
I enjoy watching old Poriot shows..I understand one more season has been made...but I only hope with captain hastings, ms lemon and inspector japp.

We're on homeland season 3 but presumably you meant that

[Scarabin]

Been watching "The white queen", a British TV series based fairly closely on the war of the roses. We're a bit behind you - I think your series ended in August - but it's enjoyable.

[mike777]

Scarabin, on 2013-October-27, 01:27, said:

We're on homeland season 3 but presumably you meant that

thank you but no.......season 2 on Netflix is a year late.....most of us don't get showtime. I hear season 2 had many problems and not that hot but I wait.

I wait for season 2 next week.

[kenberg]

Spoiler alert, Homeland details discussed below:

I do get Showtime so I am on season 3 of Homeland. The current episodes and the current news, see http://www.washingto...2b61_story.html, seem related.

But it seems to me that the writing in the last few episodes has become weaker. They get Brody back to the states and he has to get off heroin. Moreover it has to be done quickly so they give him a drug that has hallucinatory side effects. During this tme he is in a room with no padding on the walls and a wooden table that can be broken up into weapon sized pieces of wood? Unlikely. And then there is this Iranian that they have turned. I forget his name, call him X. So X is interviewing Brody in Iran and helping to arrange a meeting between Brady and the man Brody is going to kill (and now has killed). The plan is that X will then be promoted into the job of the guy Brody kills. Seems more likely X would be shot.

I still like the show immensely but I had always thought of the writing as very tightly done. They seem to be getting a little lazy. And Carrie just wanders around Tehran, unwatched, chatting with Saul on a cellphone? OK, I suppose it is a "secure" cellphone, if such a thing still exists. It's not just NSA that knows how to intercept communications is it?
But I do still like it, I like it a lot.

[blackshoe]

Years ago, in connection with science fiction, I read something about "the willing suspension of disbelief". The principle is that you must be willing to suspend your disbelief in order to enjoy the story. The same principle seems to apply to most, if not all, TV drama.

Perhaps the question of tight vs. loose writing is a different issue, I don't know.

[kenberg]

blackshoe, on 2013-December-13, 23:01, said:

Years ago, in connection with science fiction, I read something about "the willing suspension of disbelief". The principle is that you must be willing to suspend your disbelief in order to enjoy the story. The same principle seems to apply to most, if not all, TV drama.

Perhaps the question of tight vs. loose writing is a different issue, I don't know.

I think it is tricky. Take Pretty Woman, a movie that I and just about everyone enjoyed. A guy stops to ask for directions and ends up in bed with Julia Roberts. Sure, and we should all get lost more often. But given the initial assumptions, the later actions of the characters are not outside the realm of possibility. Problems arise when, moving from scene to scene, we find the actions not plausible.

[barmar]

Suspension of belief usually is applied to the basic premise or necessary prerequisites. E.g. you have to ignore the fact that FTL travel is impossible, and that aliens (if they exist at all) would not likely be remotely humanoid, when watching Star Trek or Star Wars, because we wouldn't even be able to have a show without these elements.

The problem is that sometimes the creators take liberties with reality beyond those necessary for the story's existence. If these get too absurd, it can detract from the story.

One of the issues I've seen raised about this season of Homeland is about Carrie's stay in the asylum in the first few episodes. It was revealed that it was just an act, and she and Saul were doing it to make the bad guy think that Carrie was in a bad situation with the CIA. That's fine, conspiracies like this art part of what this show is about. But the problem is that Carrie was acting insane even when no one was around. They did that so that the audience wouldn't know about the ruse, but after we find out, it sticks out.

If you're going to pull a twist like this, you have to be more careful in the writing and staging. Think about "The Sixth Sense" or the Twilight Zone episode "In the Eye of the Beholder"; if you go back and watch everything before the big reveal, you can see that they never did anything to contradict the revelation.

[kenberg]

I don't remember, perhaps never saw, "The Eye of the Beholder" but I think you are right on with "The Sixth Sense". The revealed truth was both unexpected and totally logical. Maybe not consistent with reality as I believe it to be, but no problem, it was very logical. And yes, that is what I was getting at with my comments. Suspension of dis-belief is fine, even necessary, but it is not a license to get lazy about plot developments.

With many tv shows I don't expect much. Watch it or don't watch it, but don't complain if it's a bit shoddy, it's tv. But I had come to expect more from Homeland.

[kenberg]

I mentioned earlier that we watched the pilot of Masters of Sex and liked it. I still like it, as does Becky, but there are some frustrations. All of the interesting characters are womeen, with the possible exception of Bill Masters. He is interesting but a real jerk. OK, I realize there may be some reality to women being more interesting, but still, it is relentless. Anyway, the frustration is not really that I get my nose out of joint but rather that I find Virginia Johnson to be an extremely interesting person, especially given her time, but really at any time. However, I am not sure that I trust the writers enough to believe I am getting the straight story. Libby Masters is also of great interest. I read something about the show and the writers were discussing how they "improved" her role over what appeared in the Masters/Johnson biography (by Thomas Maier) that the show is based on. Well, people are who they are, and these were real people. It's ok, i guess, for it to be entertainment based loosely on the lives of real people, Shakespeare got away with it, but I am convinced enough that these real people were really interesting and I would be happy to hear how it all really went.

Also:
It is an interesting surprise to see how often a story with such a heavy emphasis on sex can so often be very sad.

[blackshoe]

barmar, on 2013-December-14, 16:32, said:

E.g. you have to ignore the fact that FTL travel is impossible

I'm not so sure about that. General Relativity theory precludes FTL travel in our normal 4 dimensional continuum. It does not, as I understand it, preclude the possibility of "end runs" (for want of a better term) around that limitation.

barmar, on 2013-December-14, 16:32, said:

and that aliens (if they exist at all) would not likely be remotely humanoid

Not all of them, not. But then, some of the aliens in Star Trek, at least, were in no way humanoid. Remember the Horta?

[GreenMan]

blackshoe, on 2013-December-14, 23:05, said:

Not all of them, not. But then, some of the aliens in Star Trek, at least, were in no way humanoid. Remember the Horta?

Disproportionately few; even Species 8472 were tetrapods. (And they all had languages that the translator technology could render seamlessly into Earth-speak.)

[billw55]

Suspension of disbelief is a function of how well done the rest of the material is. It's much easier to ignore unrealisms when the characters and presentation are compelling, engaging, enjoyable. For example, I recently watched "Iron Man' for the first time. The physics violations were frankly hilarious, but it was ok because everything else was good enough. Same for "Avengers" - how exactly does the hulk land on a giant flying dragon, grab it, then spin it around and throw it, while still standing on it? Honestly I didn't care.

Star Trek actually went to the trouble, eventually, of explaining all the humanoid-ness. There was an episode of TNG where they found a pattern of DNA across worlds, leading to a "mother race" from which many species are descended. I thought that was cool, and offset some of the unnecessary fake jargon that was always creeping in the scripts. Whedon did it best in Firefly, focus on characters and story, and don't worry too much about technology details. Let the audience fill in the gaps in their own minds.

[barmar]

billw55, on 2013-December-16, 08:07, said:

Suspension of disbelief is a function of how well done the rest of the material is. It's much easier to ignore unrealisms when the characters and presentation are compelling, engaging, enjoyable.

Agreed. Unless you're an obsessive nitpicker, when you're enjoying the show you're not likely to focus on details like these.

I think the change in direction of Homeland may be why people are less caught up in the plotline and noticing the implausibilities and inconsistencies.

[GreenMan]

Slate's TV critic said Homeland started downhill midway through season 2 when Brody went from misunderstood bad guy to misunderstood good guy. Once the basic narrative lost its edge, the rest of the seams started to show.

It does get funny sometimes. I remember a gun enthusiast who had no problem with the idea of wormhole travel in Stargate SG-1 but complained that it was unrealistic to think the characters would switch from MP5K submachine guns to P90s.

[blackshoe]

GreenMan, on 2013-December-16, 16:50, said:

It does get funny sometimes. I remember a gun enthusiast who had no problem with the idea of wormhole travel in Stargate SG-1 but complained that it was unrealistic to think the characters would switch from MP5K submachine guns to P90s.

[Scarabin]

Perhaps TV series rely too much on ending every episode with a cliffhanger and that's why the final episode flops? Farewelled Homeland 3 & The Killing 3 without too much heartburning. Prisoners of War 2 still has 2 episodes to go but the weaknesses are beginning to show. Oh well, I guess being mystified is more exciting than resolving improbable plots. What will be the next hit?

[blackshoe]

Scarabin, on 2013-December-22, 22:16, said:

What will be the next hit?

"Intelligence" (ABC) looks like it has possibilities.