[Vampyr]

 barmar, on 2017-December-10, 22:04, said:

In ACBL, you just have to pass an open-book test.

When I got my club director certification (15-20 years ago) I took a 6-hour class at an NABC, at the end of which they gave the exam. But I suspect you can do it from home these days. To get certified as an assistant Tournament Director a few years ago they emailed me a PDF of the exam.

When I passed the club director exam a bit longer ago than you, I wasn't even required to take a class.

The ACBL should really follow the example of other countries, who run training courses. The club and county courses run by the EBU are enjoyable as well as educational.

But the incident didn't happen in the ACBL anyway.

[ye17]

 pran, on 2017-December-10, 14:45, said:

What are his qualifications as TD? Over 40 years experience as a player, or has he passed some training and exams?

He attended and passed an EBU assessment course last year. While I can understand the desirability of running a course where the pass rate is 100% to encourage more new TDs, the consequence is that this doesn't imply competence.

 Vampyr, on 2017-December-10, 18:08, said:

Which rule did the director read out? If none, you should have asked him to.

Thank you. That is a helpful suggestion for next time.

[gordontd]

 ye17, on 2017-December-11, 02:20, said:

While I can understand the desirability of running a course where the pass rate is 100% to encourage more new TDs, the consequence is that this doesn't imply competence.

The pass rate in EBU club courses is high, but it's not 100%.

[blackshoe]

Yes, you can take the club director exam "at home". You'll need a proctor (pretty sure, but not positive, he needs to be a club director or better himself). You can bring whatever books you want to the test. When I took it, there were 100 questions and 15 "bonus" questions. Of the 115 I missed three, and I still think I should have got credit for two of them, though I don't now remember the details - I was not allowed to keep a copy of the test.

[barmar]

 Vampyr, on 2017-December-10, 23:18, said:

When I passed the club director exam a bit longer ago than you, I wasn't even required to take a class.

It wasn't a requirement, just something they offered at NABCs.

[blackshoe]

The ACBL will be happy, I'm sure, to send somebody somewhere to give the course at a Regional, or even just in some city or whatever, provided they have someone available. Probably not a good idea to ask for an instructor during a NABC, if the NABC is not where you want the instruction. And of course, there will be a price. I haven't looked into that recently, but as I recall, it ain't cheap. There's also a refresher course.

[Vampyr]

 blackshoe, on 2017-December-12, 18:47, said:

The ACBL will be happy, I'm sure, to send somebody somewhere to give the course at a Regional, or even just in some city or whatever, provided they have someone available. Probably not a good idea to ask for an instructor during a NABC, if the NABC is not where you want the instruction. And of course, there will be a price. I haven't looked into that recently, but as I recall, it ain't cheap. There's also a refresher course.

In the EBU you can take the entire course (four full days, the last one assessment) at the Summer Meeting. Otherwise the individual days are offered in various places on weekends. So you could attend over the course of months or even years. There are also seminars when Laws or regulations change. The County Director course is offered once a year. It is a residential weekend, and can be taken repeat times as a refresher.

The cost is not prohibitive, and at least for the club director course a club will often sponsor members so the club has a greater qualified pool to draw from.

[blackshoe]

The EBU has a good training program for club directors. The ACBL does not.

County Director. Hm. Is that roughly equivalent to our "Local Director"?

Hm. The ACBL's TD ranks are Local, Associate Tournament Director, Tournament Director, Associate National and National. I haven't found anything to tell me what each of these means though.

[RMB1]

 blackshoe, on 2017-December-13, 10:14, said:

County Director. Hm. Is that roughly equivalent to our "Local Director"?

There are three major tiers of the EBU organisation: club, county and national.

County organisations are based roughly on administrative counties. Administrative counties were reorganised in 1974 and more changes since and local bridge politics has seen separation and amalgamation of the county associations. There are approx. 40 county associations.

There are Club Directors for clubs.

The County course qualifies County Directors (to run county events) and spot talent for national grade.

The national directors are termed "EBU Panel Directors" and have grades: trainee, Congress B, Congress A, Senior and National - in increasing order of responsibility at events. Progress through the grades is by examination and interview.

[blackshoe]

Thanks Robin. Seems similar, though different in some respects. Here, club directors work for (or own) a club. All the rest (from Local up to National) work for the ACBL. I guess the structure for ACBL directors is similar to your trainee to National. I guess we don't have a "county" equivalent, then.

[Zelandakh]

Local = Club = Copper
ATD/TD = County = Silver
AND/ND = National = Gold?

[blackshoe]

I got a reply from Sol Weinstein to my request for information about the ACBL's TD structure. He said

Quote

What you seek is not available online. There is no quick explanation. That is not TD structure

The last refers to the list of ranks I posted in #28 here.

[RMB1]

 blackshoe, on 2017-December-13, 21:14, said:

... club directors work for (or own) a club. All the rest (from Local up to National) work for the ACBL. ...

Most directors in England are not employees of the club, country or EBU.

[barmar]

 RMB1, on 2017-December-16, 16:58, said:

Most directors in England are not employees of the club, country or EBU.

What are they, independent contractors (if they get paid) and volunteers (if they don't)?

[RMB1]

 barmar, on 2017-December-17, 09:53, said:

What are they, independent contractors (if they get paid) and volunteers (if they don't)?

Self-employed contractors - but I am not sure how the tax system terminology translates.

If they were employees they would be entitled to leave and sick play and would pay tax through the employer.
Instead they choose when they are available and how they pay their taxes.

Robin

[661_Pete]

[post deleted]

[pran]

 661_Pete, on 2018-January-15, 05:17, said:

[...]

One little detail, which I didn't mention in my OP because I thought it wasn't relevant: during the evening in question, my partner/TD kept on asking me, whenever I was declarer, whether I was revoking. Yes I'm fully aware of Law 42.B.1: "Dummy may ask declarer (but not a defender) when he has failed to follow suit to a trick whether he has a card of the suit led." But to ask me "any spades, partner", "any hearts, partner", etc., every time I show out of a suit.....?

I am not in the habit of revoking, though we all have accidents at times, don't we?

I call this intimidation. Feel free to disagree.

Don't you think that

Law 74A2 said:

A player should carefully avoid any remark or extraneous action that might cause annoyance or embarrassment to another player or might interfere with the enjoyment of the game.

what needs to be said?

Given the power I would tell him to behave.

[barmar]

Many players have formed a habit of asking that question as dummy, and it can be hard to overcome the compulsion. It's not intended as intimidation, it's supposed to be helpful, so
try to take it in that spirit. Although usually they only ask the first time you show out of a particular suit -- if he asks multiple times about the same suit, that's excessive (but sometimes you forget that you already asked).

Most bridge clubs are not doing so well that they can afford to drive away players for minor issues. Now that you've brought it up, I'm really curious what improprieties you're being banned for.

[blackshoe]

"Effectively banned" makes me wonder if he's really saying he's not happy, so he's not going back, not actually banned.

[nige1]

 661_Pete, on 2018-January-15, 05:17, said:

One little detail, which I didn't mention in my OP because I thought it wasn't relevant: during the evening in question, my partner/TD kept on asking me, whenever I was declarer, whether I was revoking. Yes I'm fully aware of Law 42.B.1: "Dummy may ask declarer (but not a defender) when he has failed to follow suit to a trick whether he has a card of the suit led." But to ask me "any spades, partner", "any hearts, partner", etc., every time I show out of a suit.....?
I am not in the habit of revoking, though we all have accidents at times, don't we?
I call this intimidation. Feel free to disagree.

Law 42B1 allows dummy to take part in the play. Also, a defender can provide unauthorised information to partner, unless he always asks. Hence, Law 42B is stupid, unnecessary, and should be scrapped. While this daft law is in force, however, and until reason prevails, you might as well take advantage of it to "prevent the irregularity" of a revoke. Partner should be grateful for your concern.