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You're playing 2/1 vanilla, not that it matters here.
What now?
Any place to run?
#1
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Posted 2018-May-26, 16:27
Team match, IMPs, good opps.
You're playing 2/1 vanilla, not that it matters here.
What now?
You're playing 2/1 vanilla, not that it matters here.
What now?
#2
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Posted 2018-May-26, 17:50
Trust partner and pass is my view. If partner makes vulnerable overcalls in 2nd position on rubbish then you should get a new partner. The hand is a misfit. 2NT will play horribly, and bidding 2♠ when you have at least 5 over you is suicide.
#3
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Posted 2018-May-26, 17:56
Feels like a frying pan to fire position. Pass.
Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience. George Carlin
#4
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Posted 2018-May-26, 18:02
On a good day, partner has the singleton spade jack, RHO has the singleton 9, and we have five trump tricks in 2Sx. But more realistically, I can't score short spades by ruffing hearts so correcting to 2S is a poor proposition. For three of a minor to be right, partner probably needs five of the suit, and even then you may simply have the same losers on the hand.
So yeah, it seems like anything but pass is asking for trouble.
So yeah, it seems like anything but pass is asking for trouble.
#5
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Posted 2018-May-26, 18:13
Is there any way to bid spades naturally here? I didn't think it would be possible to convince pd I want to play in opps' suit - assuming I actually wanted that.
#6
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Posted 2018-May-26, 18:19
2S should do it. One pair in a recent Australian trials turned -800 into +670 by bidding spades on the same auction. But the spades were KQJTxxx.
2NT and redouble are both available to ask partner to pick a suit.
2NT and redouble are both available to ask partner to pick a suit.
#7
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Posted 2018-May-26, 18:50
glp
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#8
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Posted 2018-May-26, 19:17
diana_eva, on 2018-May-26, 18:13, said:
Is there any way to bid spades naturally here? I didn't think it would be possible to convince pd I want to play in opps' suit - assuming I actually wanted that.
2 ♠. If you wanted to play 3m, you could redouble or bid 2 NT. I think 2 NT should be natural since redouble asks for a minor. But 2♠ is natural.
And I would definitely bid it after RHO passed the double ( 2♠.)
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity has no such boundaries!"
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"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"
"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."
#9
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Posted 2018-May-27, 00:46
Unquestionably PASS Let partner struggle in his 2♥ and hope for as small a penalty as is possible.
Any "rescue" by you will just pour petrol on the flames Who knows? The doubler's partner might remove it
(NOT advisable for future partnership harmony) It HAS been known to happen(!)
Any "rescue" by you will just pour petrol on the flames Who knows? The doubler's partner might remove it
(NOT advisable for future partnership harmony) It HAS been known to happen(!)
"It is not enough to be a good player, you must also play well"
- Dr Tarrasch(1862-1934)German Chess Grandmaster
Bridge is a game where you have two opponents...and often three(!)
"Any palooka can take tricks with Aces and Kings; the true expert shows his prowess
by how he handles the two's and three's" - Mollo's Hideous Hog
- Dr Tarrasch(1862-1934)German Chess Grandmaster
Bridge is a game where you have two opponents...and often three(!)
"Any palooka can take tricks with Aces and Kings; the true expert shows his prowess
by how he handles the two's and three's" - Mollo's Hideous Hog
#10
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Posted 2018-May-27, 06:55
diana_eva, on 2018-May-26, 18:13, said:
Is there any way to bid spades naturally here? I didn't think it would be possible to convince pd I want to play in opps' suit - assuming I actually wanted that.
2S bid ,if made now,has to be natural as the hand has passed the 2H bid . What else can it be unless discussed earlier .?
However,personally,I would not make it opposite a stranger.
#11
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Posted 2018-May-27, 12:45
2S is natural and I expect it to be no worse than 2H - on a good day it might even be better.
#12
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Posted 2018-May-27, 12:58
Thanks all, I didn't know I would be able to bid 2S natural there. I'm not convinced in this particular situation it would have worked, because partner probably wouldn't take it as natural - we didn't discuss, nothing similar ever came up, and so it was a very grey area. But good to know for my regular partnerships.
Other table ran to 2NT, followed by 3NT which was not doubled and went down only 1. I passed and went for -1100. 14 IMPs down the drain.
Other table ran to 2NT, followed by 3NT which was not doubled and went down only 1. I passed and went for -1100. 14 IMPs down the drain.
#13
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Posted 2018-May-27, 13:49
diana_eva, on 2018-May-27, 12:58, said:
Thanks all, I didn't know I would be able to bid 2S natural there. I'm not convinced in this particular situation it would have worked, because partner probably wouldn't take it as natural - we didn't discuss, nothing similar ever came out, and so it was a very grey area. But good to know for my regular partnerships.
Other table ran to 2NT, followed by 3NT which was not doubled and went down only 1. I passed and went for -1100. 14 IMPs down the drain.
Other table ran to 2NT, followed by 3NT which was not doubled and went down only 1. I passed and went for -1100. 14 IMPs down the drain.
Most of my partners (me too) would not go anywhere near overcalling vulnerable at the 2 level without a chunky 6 card suit. Move diamond K to heart suit and this 16 count is worth a overcall. As it stands, it is worth only a pass.
#14
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Posted 2018-May-27, 13:56
Pass I am afraid.
Maarten Baltusseb
Maarten Baltusseb
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Posted 2018-May-27, 14:17
diana_eva, on 2018-May-27, 12:58, said:
Thanks all, I didn't know I would be able to bid 2S natural there. I'm not convinced in this particular situation it would have worked, because partner probably wouldn't take it as natural - we didn't discuss, nothing similar ever came up, and so it was a very grey area. But good to know for my regular partnerships.
Other table ran to 2NT, followed by 3NT which was not doubled and went down only 1. I passed and went for -1100. 14 IMPs down the drain.
Other table ran to 2NT, followed by 3NT which was not doubled and went down only 1. I passed and went for -1100. 14 IMPs down the drain.
I wonder what XX by North would be?
"definitely that's what I like to play when I'm playing standard - I want to be able to bid diamonds because bidding good suits is important in bridge" - Meckstroth's opinion on weak 2 diamond
#16
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Posted 2018-May-27, 14:24
sacto123, on 2018-May-27, 13:49, said:
Most of my partners (me too) would not go anywhere near overcalling vulnerable at the 2 level without a chunky 6 card suit. Move diamond K to heart suit and this 16 count is worth a overcall. As it stands, it is worth only a pass.
You must miss an awful lot of vulnerable games if you pass with this 16 count.
First choice 2S, second choice take out double. Pass is not a consideration.
#17
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Posted 2018-May-27, 16:38
Tramticket, on 2018-May-27, 14:24, said:
You must miss an awful lot of vulnerable games if you pass with this 16 count.
First choice 2S, second choice take out double. Pass is not a consideration.
First choice 2S, second choice take out double. Pass is not a consideration.
You make a very good point. I am lucky to have a partner that seldom will let a 1 bid die in 4th seat.
#18
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Posted 2018-May-27, 17:02
Diana, the reason I replied I would have bid 2♠ is.
A1-Assume you and your pd bidding freely and you both have an equal quality suit vs stiff on the other side. which suit do you want to play in? Most people would want to play in the suit of the weak hand.
A2-For the same reason, you do not want the trump of their weak hand to be set as trump.
B-By letting 2♥ doubled, you know you will be playing 2♥ doubled. 2♠ will likely also be doubled, but you can't know unless you bid it. Both suits are in front of the trump stack.
C-You have decent intermediates of ♠ suit that pd may not have in ♥ suit.
A1-Assume you and your pd bidding freely and you both have an equal quality suit vs stiff on the other side. which suit do you want to play in? Most people would want to play in the suit of the weak hand.
A2-For the same reason, you do not want the trump of their weak hand to be set as trump.
B-By letting 2♥ doubled, you know you will be playing 2♥ doubled. 2♠ will likely also be doubled, but you can't know unless you bid it. Both suits are in front of the trump stack.
C-You have decent intermediates of ♠ suit that pd may not have in ♥ suit.
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity has no such boundaries!"
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"
"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"
"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."
#19
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Posted 2018-May-27, 18:46
diana_eva, on 2018-May-27, 12:58, said:
Thanks all, I didn't know I would be able to bid 2S natural there. I'm not convinced in this particular situation it would have worked, because partner probably wouldn't take it as natural - we didn't discuss, nothing similar ever came up, and so it was a very grey area. But good to know for my regular partnerships.
Other table ran to 2NT, followed by 3NT which was not doubled and went down only 1. I passed and went for -1100. 14 IMPs down the drain.
Other table ran to 2NT, followed by 3NT which was not doubled and went down only 1. I passed and went for -1100. 14 IMPs down the drain.
Your partner has a takeout double, not an overcall.
"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere."
#20
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Posted 2018-May-27, 19:09
Tramticket, on 2018-May-27, 14:24, said:
You must miss an awful lot of vulnerable games if you pass with this 16 count.
First choice 2S, second choice take out double. Pass is not a consideration.
First choice 2S, second choice take out double. Pass is not a consideration.
(Presuming you mean 2H rather than 2S ...)
I have to admit that I have much more sympathy with a pass than with 2H. I would double, but this isn't such a great hand that I want to get too adventurous.
Looking at the very small sample here, there appears to be a direct correlation between bidding 2H on this hand and 2S on the original one. Not all that surprising really.