[eagles123]

2nd seat vul vs not MP, pass to you

QJ
Q987532
T2
KQ

[smerriman]

I think I would bid 2♥, it's an awful hand but it's going to be an equally awful decision next time round if I pass, and both 1♥ and 3♥ feel way too much.

[mikeh]

It’s a guess but…..RHO passed so the odds that this is our hand have increased slightly. If it’s our hand, I’m going to feel much better having passed than having bid, so I pass.

If I were to bid, and bidding may well work out, I agree with 2H.

Btw, I don’t think this is ‘an awful’ hand nor do I expect huge problems if partner gets to open in 4th seat but I do agree that if both LHO and partner bid, thus may become awkward.

[Douglas43]

Weak 2♥ for me. We sometimes do this with 7222 and poor suit. 3♥ rebid over Ogust 2NT.

[DavidKok]

A clear pass, and I'd prefer 1♥ to 2♥. Partner will always take the wrong competitive decision after we open 2♥, with this much defence, no shortness, an extra heart and no suit. We don't even want the suit led, and if the opponents win the auction LHO is likely to declare.

[Tramticket]

Pass.

My second-seat, vulnerable weak-two bids will have more than one honour in the suit. Furthermore we have 8 out of 10 points in our short suits, giving us more potential defence.

[mycroft]

Agreeing with all. This is a really nice hand, but one I can't show with my system. I doubt I'll be putting a zero in my scoreline, which means I will get a chance to show this hand next round, once I find out whether I'm preempting the opponents or offering help to partner. If it's the former, it won't be as effective as if I did it now; if it's the latter, I'll be showing a lot more help than if I bid now.

First seat or (especially) third, different story. But because our preempts are aggressive (even second seat unfavourable, at least compared to the field), we have to cater for partner's bad preempts; here even 8-12 of the other cards after me frequently makes game, and partner will never play for it.

[LBengtsson]

There is a big difference at bidding MP against IMPS. It is just one hand. My style is aggressive here. 1 quick trick, 7 card suit even this poor I bid 3♥, even red/white. Take away the opps bidding space, tell partner you have a 7 card suit and so little defense. I do not see two honor doubletons as good defense when they amount to just 1 quick trick in my hand as they stand. Pass, I feel, puts a lot more pressure to describe the hand on the next turn if allowed to. Opening 2♥ here just makes it easier for the opps. to compete. IMPs I pass, MPs I bid

If we end up in 3♥X and go for 500 I will take my responsibility

[pescetom]

Pass in second seat is clear for me, the interesting question is what to do with this in first.
I would probably open 1♥, partner is never going to play me for this if I bid 2♥.

[mycroft]

I like your style LBengtsson. For me, however, I'm much more concerned with putting +170 (or +680) on my scorecard than -500. Or even, frankly, +200 (even if +500 wouldn't be a good score against +620) when partner plays me for KQxxxxx Qx in the round suits, or undercounts their trump ♠Kxx by a trick or two.

Sure ♣KQ is only a trick on defence - I've never said different. But it's most of a trick more than Qx or even Kx, which is what partner has any right to expect.

But if you and your partner have agreed that even second seat unfavourable, this should be preempted, and partner takes this kind of hand into her analysis, then absolutely go for it. Playing EHAA, if I pass this hand (or, frankly, if I do *anything* other than bid 2♥ with it), partner will 100% blame me if we get a bad score. Playing Precision, passing this hand rather than bidding an 11-15 1♥ would seem to me like taking a position. But I assumed we were in a "normal" (possibly Acol) context here.

[DavidKok]

Preempting on a hand with lots of defence and little to no offence loses in more ways than just +170 - it also loses when the opponents bid to (say) 4♠ and partner valiantly sacrifices in 5♥, turning +50 into -800. The total playing strength of the hand is not that important.

[johnu]

DavidKok, on 2022-July-11, 10:30, said:

Preempting on a hand with lots of defence and little to no offence loses in more ways than just +170 - it also loses when the opponents bid to (say) 4♠ and partner valiantly sacrifices in 5♥, turning +50 into -800. The total playing strength of the hand is not that important.

Worrying that partner may sacrifice vul versus not at the 5 level doesn't seem like a big consideration when you open a weak 2.

[DavidKok]

I'm happy to include phantom sacrifices at all levels, not just the 5-level. Competing 3-over-3 can be a loss just like 5-over-4 can be.

[eagles123]

I passed, didn't particularly like it, but it felt like the least bad option!

Partner had:

Axxx
Jtx
AKQx
Ax

so 4H was a trivial contract to get to regardless of opening bid. A few had 3H - 6H auctions which wasn't a success with West holding AK of hearts. A certain Mr. Rodwell was one of them! A few had to deal with a 3C opening on xx x Jxx 98xxxxxx but I had a look at what others did who didn't face the preemption and here's the breakdown:


P: 10
1H: 11
2H: 21
3H: 37

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

pass.

In the end, if you are in a regular partnership, you have an idea,
how much / how weak p expects a 2H to be.
Similar regarding 1H.

with kind regards
Marlowe

[helene_t]

2♥ for me. The 7th hard makes up for the awful honour location so the O-D is about right.

Maybe in a partnership in which we have some agreements about passed-hand bidding in competition, pass becomes more attractive.

[mw64ahw]

helene_t, on 2022-July-12, 05:02, said:

2♥ for me. The 7th hard makes up for the awful honour location so the O-D is about right.

Maybe in a partnership in which we have some agreements about passed-hand bidding in competition, pass becomes more attractive.

Ditto with 7♥ with an easy 3♥ follow-up if partner can manage 2NT

[mw64ahw]

helene_t, on 2022-July-12, 05:02, said:

2♥ for me. The 7th hard makes up for the awful honour location so the O-D is about right.

Maybe in a partnership in which we have some agreements about passed-hand bidding in competition, pass becomes more attractive.

Ditto for me. 7!♥ and almost 6 playing tricks is enough vul. with an easy 3♥ response if partner can summon up 2NT

[LBengtsson]

eagles123, on 2022-July-11, 16:07, said:

I passed, didn't particularly like it, but it felt like the least bad option!

Partner had:

Axxx
Jtx
AKQx
Ax

so 4H was a trivial contract to get to regardless of opening bid. A few had 3H - 6H auctions which wasn't a success with West holding AK of hearts. A certain Mr. Rodwell was one of them! A few had to deal with a 3C opening on xx x Jxx 98xxxxxx but I had a look at what others did who didn't face the preemption and here's the breakdown:


P: 10
1H: 11
2H: 21
3H: 37

Lol. Rodwell was as aggressive as me! But I do not understand 3♥ - 6♥ bidding. Yes, you can count to 12 tricks easily, but if partner has ♥AKxxxxx there are possible squeeze options to make 7♥. If Mr Rodwell's partner knows how aggressive he is why the hurry to bid 6♥, why not bid RKCB first?

[eagles123]

Rodwell was the 6H bidder